MOV does not work WD HD TV

posted in Video Codecs, viewed 13k times

I have a Nikon Coolpix 5600 recording movies in MOV format. The Western Digital player supports the MOV MPEG 4 and H.264. The HD player does not recognize the format. It had no problem with the WMV format. Even Nero had a problem with the MOV format. My computer kept crashing. Should I buy the Quicktime pro or convert this to WMV or some other format? Will I lose the video quality if I convert? reply

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02-22-2009 09:46 PM
pto160

You may get a HD MOV video, which cannot be carried by your player and nero. But I’m not sure about it.

You can download a video converter(free trail) and convert video to check if it would work.

p.s. Any video conversion will lead to quality loss. reply

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02-23-2009 01:44 AM
PrometheusHill
212 posts

I didn’t know Western Digital got into the hardware media player market! Anyway thanks for the heads up (google helped too).

Note: If your player is this one, there’s a new firmware update (1.01), so I’d grab it.

Truly impressive specifications (see the manuals on this page).
Anyway, delving deeper in the manual reveals that for the MOV container, the only video codec supported is MPEG-4.
Unfortunately, Nikon CoolPix 5600 uses Photo-JPEG for video.
So yes, in your specific case, any conversion you do will have to be lossy (though you can adjust parameters to minimize that loss).

So what are your options?
- This is my personal favorite way of dealing with this. Get MP4Cam2AVI (freeware and open-source), and convert the movie to Xvid in one click. The default setting is to have a lossless transcoding of both the audio and video streams from the MOV container to the AVI container, but you don’t want that. Under video format, pick one of the Xvid. Under audio format, pick either uncompressed (PCM) (may take quite a bit of space) or mp3. Your resulting AVI should play in the player. If not, perhaps your player doesn’t support the fourcc (four character code) XVID (the manual doesn’t state which fourcc’s used by MPEG-4 part 2 they support - but I tend to assume XVID is one of them). Use a fourcc changer and change it to DX50 or DIVX.
- If you go the QuickTime Pro route ($30 from Apple), click file, export. Pick Movie to QuickTime Movie for MOV, or Movie to MPEG-4 (for MP4), then click options.
For video, click settings and be sure to pick MPEG-4 (since it’s the only codec supported by the player in MOV and MP4 (at least according to the manual - if you’re adventurous, try H.264 with MP4 and see if that works)). You should leave top options to automatic (key frames and bitrate), set frame rate to current, depth to millions of colors, and set quality to high or better.
Then for sound, either linear PCM or AAC should work. Try to be consistent with what you get from your input though (Nikon 5600 produces 8-bit, mono, 8 KHz).
You probably won’t need internet streaming, so you can uncheck that.
I do have one qualm about using QuickTime Pro to encode to MPEG-4: quality. See this extremetech article:
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,1544898,00.asp
(one of the screenshots: MPEG-4 = Apple MPEG-4 in this context)
Apple’s implemention of MPEG-4 is pretty awful.
One option you have if you’re still attached to the MOV container is to use 3ivx for your encoding. Download it here. On the drop-down menu for codecs in QuickTime Pro you’ll have 3ivx. The thing is it encodes in the exact same fourcc as Apple MPEG-4 (mp4v), so it’s perfectly readable in any other computer with QuickTime (even without 3ivx installed), and the quality is much better. However the codec is a 30-day trial.
- You can convert to MPEG-1. Use TMPGEnc Free Edition in conjunction with the QuickTime plugin. TMPGEnc can be found here: http://www.tmpgenc.net. The download button is well-hidden: after you pick your language, it’s at the top of the page between 'about tmpgenc' and download). Then get the QuickTime Plugin from here. Put that file into the same folder as where you extracted your TMPGEnc files. Open TMPGEnc. Skip the wizard. Drag and drop your movie onto the window (you may have to do it twice). Then click settings and adjust the settings to your liking (I recommend MPEG-1, Constant Quality (settings, quality=100, max bitrate=100,000), frame rate same as your original mov, Motion Search Precision of highest Quality; not sure about audio settings). Note the size has to have multiples of 16 (a restriction of the MPEG format). If your .mov is a weird resolution, just overshoot a little, and under the advanced tab, under video arrange method, pick center keep aspect ratio. When you’re done with your adjustments, go to the top and click start.
- If you want to convert it to wmv. You’d have to get QuickTime Alternative first. This will contain DirectShow filters to enable your MOV files to be read in Windows Media Player and other Windows apps. Then you can use Windows Media Encoder 9 (more powerful) or Windows Movie Maker (for novices) to encode your video into wmv with video codec windows media video 9.

Random rant: I’m a bit surprised Western Digital omitted Motion JPEG/Photo JPEG as a supported codec. They got all the major containers (MPEG, AVI, MOV, MP4, WMV, MKV), and video codecs (MPEG-1, MPEG-2, MPEG-4 part 2 (aka the DivX Xvid 3ivx etc...), H.264 (aka MPEG-4 part 10 aka AVC), and VC-1 (which includes Windows Media Video 9)), but they omitted Motion JPEG (AVI)/Photo JPEG (MOV), which is used by most digital cameras out there! reply

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02-23-2009 04:32 AM
anonymous
1,580 posts

Thanks. The WD HD is a great device. There seems to be compatibility issues with the MOV format. The WD HD TV recognized a 4 year old WMV clip no problem sent to me in an email. There seems to be more stable codec for the WMV format. Is maybe the reason why the WD does not support Photo JPEG is because the codec varies too much from camera to camera? Does WMV have a WMV photo jpeg?
I probably should contact WD to see if there any plans to support the MOV JPEG format before I convert. So it probably is a choice between XVID and WMV. Does anyone know any camera or camcorder that supports WMV. reply

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02-23-2009 08:41 PM
pto160

Is MP4Cam2AVI Easy Converter only to convert MPEG 4 to AVI or can it work with MOV JPEG? reply

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02-23-2009 08:52 PM
pto160

Yes, MP4Cam2AVI supports Photo JPEG MOV. By default it changes to Motion JPEG AVI, but as I said before it can make it Xvid AVI for your convenience.
Note: Motion JPEG used in AVI (fourcc MJPG) and Photo JPEG used in MOV (fourcc jpeg) are actually the same - if you do a lossless transcode using a different lossless transcoder (for example smartvid from Intel), then you change the fourcc, it should work perfectly. MP4Cam2AVI does this automatically for you.

As for Photo JPEG/Motion JPEG not being supported: I doubt it has to do with variation - they’re all the same (even though ironically there isn’t an official standard for motion or photo jpeg). Get digital camera samples from the web of various digital cameras that use those formats and you’ll realize they’re the same.
There’s also a reason why the WD shouldn’t have trouble supporting it: it supports still JPEGs. Motion JPEG is just a bunch of JPEG frames put together. The compression (JPEG compression) is done on the individual frame, and there’s no worrying about interframe compression (like in MPEG). It’s commonly implemented in digital cameras because it takes little modification to the existing (JPEG-picture-taking) hardware to combine the frames into a movie. (got that from the wikipedia article on Motion JPEG).
Perhaps you could write WD and suggest to them to support Photo JPEG in future releases (since it’s used by so many digital cameras - although they’re slowly moving to MPEG-4 and H.264, but the bulk of cameras still in people’s possession are Photo/Motion JPEG).

WMV doesn’t have photo/motion jpeg, but you could artificially create it. There’s a command-line tool part of windows media tools/netshow tools (the precursors to windows media encoder) called vid2asf (or vidtoasf I don’t remember) that will losslessly transcode the audio and video stream from AVI to (you guessed it) ASF. You can probably find it lying around somewhere on the web. (BTW ASF and WMV are the same container format - Microsoft rebranded it “Windows Media Video” later on to make sure people got the message that it’s Their Format (Windows).) Not sure if you’ll need a DirectShow codec (as opposed to a vfw (video for windows) codec)to play back the asf later on. and if you need to, you can always rename the extension to wmv if the wd won’t recognize the asf extension.
P.S: Microsoft does have picture-related codecs WMVP (windows media image) WVP2 (windows media image version 2), but it’s for stuff like photo story or slide shows - not related to motion jpeg at all.

Random thought: if WD wants to be future-proof they could start supporting flv files - that’d be interesting given the millions of video files sitting on youtube. the downside would be the royalties they’d have to pay adobe (owners of the flash video format), on top of what they’re already paying the mpeg licensing authority (for mpeg-1, mpeg-2, mp3, mpeg-4, h.264, mp4, and aac), apple (for mov) and microsoft (for asf/wmv and vc-1). thank goodness motion jpeg doesn’t have a standard, and avi and mkv are license-free!

the mov vs. wmv compatibility. find yourself a wmv encoded in Windows Media Video 7 or Windows Media Video 8 and play it in your player. Find a MOV encoded in mpeg-4 and try it. It’s more about the video codec than the container/format. reply

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02-23-2009 10:36 PM
anonymous
1,580 posts

I need to do some movie editing. I am thinking of buying Adobe Premiere Elements. Does it do a good job of converting the MOV JPEG format to WMV or some other compatible format. WD told me to check at their website in the future to see if there is a codec for the MOV JPEG format. Do any camcorders or cameras support DVD video and WMV or FLV?
I am probably going to hold off on converting the MOV JPEG for the time being. reply

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02-24-2009 09:50 PM
pto160

It’s not as tedious as you think. MP4Cam2AVI has a batch mode where you select a bunch of files, then convert them all in one click.
I’ve never tried adobe premiere, so I don’t know its capabilities. You may want to google around to see if it natively reads MOV or whether it requires third-party filters (like those bundled in QuickTime Alternative).

There are digital cameras that record in ASF, but the quality isn’t exactly pristine. They tend to record in MP4S (Microsoft ISO MPEG 4 version 1).
There are many digital camcorders that record in DVD format (MPEG-2). I don’t know if there any digital cameras that do though. And I believe many of those digital camcorders actually record to mini-DVD+/-R. When you shop around, just look at the specs (see if MPEG-2 is mentioned).
I’ll add one comment about that: I’m not impressed by camcorders that record in MPEG-2 (or DV). Being a digital guy, I like progressive images. MPEG-2 specs allow for interlaced contents, and I think it may be why it was the chosen codec for those devices.
I don’t (personally) know of any hardware device that supports flv at the moment. Like I said before, it’d be a huge investment because of the millions of videos on youtube (especially now since they’ve recently added high quality). reply

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02-26-2009 09:53 AM
anonymous
1,580 posts

Thanks. Western Digital provided a converter software called Arcsoft Media Converter 2.5. Should I use this to convert the video files? Does Arcsoft have a good reputation for video conversion? I will probably hold off for the time being until they will hopefully support the MOV format. reply

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03-02-2009 10:19 PM
pto160

Sorry about the late reply.
The only way to find out is to try it! I suspect it’s not a lossless conversion as it would be with MP4Cam2AVI though. It’s easy to tell: check the codec of the output (and the size - it should be almost the same as the original). reply

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03-04-2009 11:51 AM
anonymous
1,580 posts

Just to inform you: two weeks ago I tried out
prerelease 1.02.07 - MOD worked out of the box. Take a look at http://www.wdc.com/wdtvprerelease/ reply

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05-27-2009 04:19 AM
phil74

i have sony vegas movie studio but i can imropt mov files into it so movie studio version 9 hd is different from the original movie studio? And your right the file are way too huge i did a 2 min vid which took 200mb of space.. reply

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05-11-2012 08:35 PM
Fara

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